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Tucker Simmons: What’s up guys? Its been a few weeks since we wrapped up Part One. I’ve spent this downtime sifting through leads and catching up on those future episodes for Part Two. But as many of you may already know, there was a major development yesterday in Donna’s case. We’re right here at Christmas and everyone’s with their families or on vacations, so this episode isn’t as produced as the others, but we wanted to make sure you had the information as soon as possible. So let’s dive in.
“Something Strange” by Tabitha Meeks: I’m feeling heavy there’s a pounding in my chest, the shadows hiding but I see the siluettes, fear lives in the quiet, whispers in the silence.
Tucker Simmons: I’m Tucker Simmons and this is Freeze Frame, an investigation into the unsolved murder of Donna Arsenalau. Yesterday, Washington Parish Sheriff Jason Smith announced his administration has officially taken the Arceneaux case back from the Louisiana State Police Just to refresh your memory, since 2019, the Louisiana State Police have had Donna’s case. At that time, her family had lost confidence in the investigation, for good reason, so it made sense for the State Police to take over. Throughout this podcast, I’ve been critical at times of their investigation and what appears to be, a lack of action based on the information available to me. They’ve interviewed a lot of people, processed a significant amount of evidence from the scene of the crime, and from my understanding, even reinterviewed a few interested parties based on information revealed in this podcast. But after so many years and multiple investigators on and off the case, I believe yesterday’s announcement is a huge step forward. So why don’t we just start with the announcement itself? This is the audio of the video Sheriff Smith posted online Monday morning.
Jason Smith: Hey, so we’ve been in discussions with the State Police and as of last week, we now have responsibility for investigating Donna Arseneaux’s murder. I want to thank the podcast. You know, it’s fair to say that had the podcast not generated the attention that it did, and it has generated a lot of attention both inside the Parish and outside even the State we, we wouldn’t be looking into this case now. There is a higher legal threshold that we’re go going to have to meet beyond just entertainment in order to move this case forward. But I do appreciate them looking into it and keeping the interest in this case alive. I’m also thankful for the State Police They didn’t ask to get this case. It should never have been given to them in the first place, and now it’s back where it rightly belongs. We’re gonna continue to work with them. It’s almost like we’re on a road trip, the only difference now is we pulled over and changed drivers. But they’re going to continue to support us, they’ve got lots of resources. But as the Chief Law Enforcement officer in Washington Parish it’s my responsibility to investigate crimes that happen inside the Parish to our citizens. And now the case is back where it should always have been. We’re going toa do regular updates on the status of the case. I ask everybody’s patience, I’m not sure what that timeline is going to be, and I’ll be as transparent as I can. But it’s up to us now to bring this case forward and to resolve it not only for the victim, not only for her family, but for those that may have been falsely implicated. I want to give everybody an opportunity to tell their story so that we can get to the bottom of that. The things that I’ve seen with the case so far, I’m pretty confident that we can get this thing resolved. How long it’s going to take, I’m not entirely sure, so I ask everybody’s patience. And anything less than justice in this case is going to be unacceptable. And that’s what we’re working. Outside of that, I appreciate everybody’s attention and interest. If you know anything or you feel like you need to say something, you can go to our website and register an anonymous tip on the website, or you can certainly go through the podcast. I’m taking information from all sources. I’m not going to discount them just because of who they are. It’s up to us to find out what’s true and what’s not true, and we’re going to get to the bottom of this. I want to wish everybody a Mary Christmas and Happy New Year, and there’ll be more to come. Thanks so much.
Tucker Simmons: This announcement is less than three minutes long, but there’s a ton of information to dissect. As you can imagine, I had 101 questions after listening to Sheriff Smith’s announcement, so I gave him a call.
Tucker Simmons: Hey, Sheriff Smith. You made some, some news today. Was hoping you could chat for a few minutes.
Sheriff Jason Smith: Sure.
Tucker Simmons: I think last time we spoke, you were pretty confident in the State Police’s investigation or at least the little bit that you’ve had seen. Was there anything specific that happened or has this all come about?
Sheriff Jason Smith: No, I think the only change really is probably a character flaw on my part is that I’m just impatient and if, you know, I’m put in a position where people will constantly ask me questions about the case. And I figured if I was going to get asked questions, I wanted to be able to be in a position to answer those questions. And I could not do that if we were in a supporting role to the State Police And so it wasn’t anything specific that I was dissatfied with. I just wanted, I felt like I was, would be more comfortable if I was in the driver’s seat and they were in a supporting position and then we could direct the investigation forward.
Tucker Simmons: Right, right. I should say thanks for the shout out for the podcast. We appreciate that. I think…
Sheriff Jason Smith: Well, I mean, it wasn’t, it’s the truth in the sense that I think a lot of people know of cases that they’re dissatisfied with the resolution of. And because we’re just dealing with people, the more attention you bring to something, it starts to energize the people that are meant to investigate these things. Cases that don’t get investigated, it’s usually not as a result of people willfully not investigating something. It’s just that everything is racked and they’re prioritized. You know, every day is a triage and you have to decide what’s more important on a daily basis. And so, without that level of attention, some of these cases just don’t get focused on.
Tucker Simmons: Well, that was our goal from the beginning, just to bring awareness. You know, I haven’t been shy about my skepticism of the State Police and also the original investigation. So we’re excited to see, how things progress. And if there’s information that we have that you need, we’re an open book. But I guess my only concern is will anyone who was originally on the case be working it again for you, or have you made a decision about who’s going to be working it?
Sheriff Jason Smith: No, nobody that is working the case or nobody that worked the case, in 2017 is going to be on the case now. I don’t even have, I think I have one detective that may have assisted in the case in 2017 that’s still with the Sheriff’s Office Everybody else has left. My Chief Investigator is going to be the lead investigator on this. He comes from St Tammany Parish so he’s completely unaffiliated with anything that’s gone on, and he’s held this job at a much larger agency, and it’s had a much larger role. We’ve got some assistance from the district attorney’s Office They’re going to look at it through a prosecutorial lens. They’re completely unaffiliated with the case. So we’re definitely bringing in a new energy to the case with a new perspective. I think that was one of the things I tried to focus on during the campaign is that we’re not in the business of protecting our ego at the expense of getting a resolution to anything. It’s more important to me to just get to the bottom of something.
Tucker Simmons: We love hearing that. Obviously, you’ve seen details of the case. I’m not sure how much you can share, but do you feel like there’s a lot of investigating left to do or things that are. That the State Police were waiting on coming back, or is it just a matter of getting enough for the prosecutor to act?
Sheriff Jason Smith: Well, at the risk of being vague and evasive, it’s a little bit of all of that. There are some things that I do know from looking at the case file and reading some of the transcripts of official statements, some of the people that spoke on the podcast, the things that they said differed a bit from the things they said in their official statements. And so those are some of the things, some of the discrepancies we’re going to have to clarify. There are some forensic things that need to be clarified, and analyzed. I’m fairly confident with what we’ve got that we can resolve this. I think your original question was how much investigating actually needs to be done. I honestly don’t think a lot of investigating needs to be done. It just. There’s some things that need to be tightened up a bit in order to bring this, put this in front of a Grand Jury and then we’ll go from there.
Tucker Simmons: Well, yeah, I’ve attempted to talk to Bas a few times. We just haven’t coordinated. But my question for him has always been, what is the threshold to bring the case to the Grand Jury and actually prosecute? And I haven’t ever really gotten an answer, but, it sounds like his Office is on board, so that’s progress.
Sheriff Jason Smith: Well, it’s one of those things like, you know, how long can you drive a car with the warning light on? Like, there’s no clear answer to that question that the District Attorney, he has to prioritize which cases he brings forward. And it really comes down to the prosecutor that he’s assigned to the case, some of the evidence involved in the case, some of the actions of the investigating agency. There’s a lot of different variables that go into what is essentially a subjective decision. There are some objective legal standards that have to be met. But at the end of the day, it’s his decision on which cases to bring forward. And there’s not a matrix or a checklist or anything else that he has to decide. Now he, he’s the district attorney for the entire 22nd Judicial District, which encompasses St. Tammany and Washington Parish. So that’s a lot of cases. So a case from 2017 is not going to be high on his list. That’s really where I come in. If I want him to bring this case forward, I’m going to have to be the one that advocates it and convinces him that this is something that is worthy of prosecution.
Tucker Simmons: Well, it sounds like you’re doing that. So
Sheriff Jason Smith: Well we’re trying to.
Tucker Simmons: Yeah. I’m assuming you’ve listened to the podcast with, you know, locals are talking about it a lot and it’s all over social media. So have you heard everything or are you purposely not listening with what s your thought on Pocast?
Sheriff Jason Smith: Yeah, I have tried to stay away from it, if I’m honest. I have… I wanted to remain objective just because I knew at some point we were going to get the case returned to us or I wanted to get the case returned to us. But the truth is that my wife has been obsessed with it, the podcast, and so I’ve heard parts of it and I’m constantly asked about it. Ah. And I think it probably speaks to the quality of the podcast and that the things that people tell me are all pretty consistent. You know, it’s not wide variety of things that people are saying to me. So the message that you’re trying to get out has been received by people because they’re delivering it back to me. so I’m familiar with some of it. I haven’t sat down and listened to it. but that’s a long way to answer a very short question. Yeah, I’ve listened to some of it.
Tucker Simmons: Hopefully it will be helpful.
Sheriff Jason Smith: No’s, like I said, it’s been very helpful so far. I mean, you’ve done a lot of work on this. I know there are some people that probably think that we shouldn’t use anything that’s from the podcast because podcasts are designed to entertain people. But it’s information, and I would be foolish not to use any information that I thought might be helpful. I don’t really care where it comes from. so the work that you’ve done, I’m very grateful for because you’ve done a lot of work, far more than anybody, else has done on it.
Tucker Simmons: Well, I appreciate that. We just want to know what happened. That sounds like, this is a really great development. So we appreciate your interest in the case as well, and I know Donna’s family does. So like I said before, if you need anything, let us know. Just out of curiosity, what is the process for getting the case back? I mean, does State Police like, actually hand deliver the case fileing evidence to your Office or how does that work?
Sheriff Jason Smith: We met with them. A lot of it is electronic. some of it is paper copies and hard copies of things. my chief deputy went down to their investigative Office and we just took possession of it. They transferred back the electronic files to us and gave us all the hard copies of stuff. I mean, there wasn’t a ceremony or an official letter or anything. It was, much in the same way that we gave them the case, we just got it returned to us.
Tucker Simmons: Yeah, it didn’t seem like there was ever a formal transfer, so I was just curious.
Sheriff Jason Smith: No, honestly, I haven’t done this before you. I’ve only been to Sheriff since the 1st of July, and I actually asked that question. I had assumed that we would have to have some sort of official notification, but, that’s just really not the way these things work. And it’s interesting that the default position is that the Sheriff is responsible for the case. So it was always going to be mine as soon as I became comfortable in asking for it. And there were some things that delayed my decision. You know, we just taken over the Sheriff’s Office There was a lot of moving parts, and I wasn’t comfortable early on, even though I had been made aware of the case. And I think my intention had always been to get the case back. I wasn’t prepared and I wasn’t confident enough in our operating procedures to say, hey, let’s take on this other cold case from 2017. Amongst all the other things that we’re dealing with problems in the jail, problems with personnel, moving the 911 dispatch. I mean, I could go down a long list of things that are in front of us every day. And so, the only thing that’s change is now here we’re six months down the road, and I feel a lot more comfortable in what we’ve got going on that I think we can take this on and give it the energy and attention that it deserves.
Tucker Simmons: Excellent. Well, I appreciate all the info and if there’s anything that you need from us, happy to help. We provided a lot of it to the State Police already, but if it doesn’t make its way to you, happy to provide what we can.
Sheriff Jason Smith: Hey, Tucker, let me call you back.
Tucker Simmons: Okay.
Tucker Simmons: Before we wrapped up, Sheriff Smith ended our call abruptly. A few minutes later, he called back after pulling someone over.
Sheriff Jason Smith: Well, yeah, sorry about that. We’re driving back from Bougalusa this guy passed like four vehicles in a row on a hill. And after the events of last Sunday, I’m a little, I have very little patience for that.
Tucker Simmons: There were multiple fatalities in a car accident a week prior. It was interesting to see how hands on he is firsthand. I’m not sure Washington Parish has had such an engaged and working Sheriff for quite some time.
Sheriff Jason Smith: No, the only thing I think I probably would ask is just to temper people’s expectations. you know, we’re not ready to bring this to a Grand Jury for anything yet, and I’m not sure what it’s going to require yet to get in front of a Grand Jury So everyone just needs to understand that this isn’t an episode of Law and Order where we can go from crime to conviction in an hour’s time. It’s going to take a little bit of time. Unfortunately it’s been since 2017, so it’s worth it to me to make it to go a little bit more slowly, Then, I want to do a correct it quickly, if that makes sense.
Tucker Simmons: Yeah, for sure. I think everyone will understand that. Again, thanks for, the shout out to the podcast and if we’ve been able to help in any way, that was the goal. So I’ll check back in and see how things are going.
Sheriff Jason Smith: Sounds great. I appreciate itol.
Tucker Simmons: Thanks Sheriff.
Tucker Simmons: He doesn’t have a magic wand, but the fact that he already has buy in from the DA’s Office is extremely important. I have no doubt this process won’t happen overnight, but fresh eyes on the case and a game plan to get it in front of a Grand Jury Man, it’s just such a relief knowing there’s actually a plan in place. Speaking of a Grand Jury in Louisiana, it’s a panel of 12 citizens, typically serving anywhere from 12 to 18 months. Grand Jury proceedings or closed door sessions where the prosecutor presents evidence, witnesses can be called under oath, and evidence can be Subpoenaed Grand juries are enlisted to test the prosecution’s case and determine if there’s enough compelling evidence to support an arrest. A true bill is confirmation that there is sufficient evidence. A no bill is the opposite: there isn’t sufficient evidence. As the Sheriff explained, it’ll be up to he and his team to assemble a compelling case that convinces the DA’s Office to get the ball rolling. Sheriff Smith has publicly spoken about this podcast now, but much like Demmie told me way back when I first spoke to her, I don’t want him or his team taking my word for what’s in the podcast. I wouldn’t expect them to. Now they have all the evidence, and once they’ve had a chance to review the case file in full, I expect our investigation will speak for itself. Shortly after Sheriff Smith’s announcement, I received a text from Donna’s brother, tj. After my call with the Sheriff I wanted to update TJ and help explain what all this means. So I looped in his sister Sherry as well.
Tucker Simmons: All right, Sherry, TJ, you guys both there?
Sherry (Donna’s Sister): Hey. Hey, T.
TJ (Donna’s brother): You.
Tucker Simmons: Well, thanks for hopping on so early. TJ I know you are aware of the news this morning because you sent me a text, but I just thought we’d talk about it as a group. So Jason Smith announced this morning that the Sheriff’s Office officially has dona case back. They’ve got cooperation from the DA’s Office and Jason’s, number two, his chief investigator, will be taking the lead.
Sherry (Donna’s Sister): Okay. I guess that’s good. I mean. Okay, so what happened that made him decide to take it back?
Tucker Simmons: A couple months ago, when the State Police presented he and his chief their investigation, they felt like it wasn’t appropriate to take the case back. But I think as time went on, they were getting so many questions about the case and felt like they didn’t have enough information, and the State Police are overwhelmed as it is. So he basically said, we would like to keep you, the State as a resource, but he really wanted to take ownership of it and devote resources.
Sherry (Donna’s Sister): Yeah.
Tucker Simmons: TJ, I think I interrupted you a second ago. You’re gonna ask something.
TJ (Donna’s brother): I’m like, Sherry, what else do… I mean… what’s…
Tucker Simmons: The issue is, is the State Police the whole time they’ve been investigating, the DA’s Office has not been involved or privy to the case. So I think what’s going to happen now and what Jason confirmed is his purpose for getting the case back is so that Collin Sims and his prosecutor can be actively involved in what evidence there is there. And it’s very possible that the prosecutor will look at it and say there’s an overwhelming amount of information here. Let’s take it to the Grand Jury get an indictment. Or the prosecutor could say, look, it’s very circumstantial. You need to retest this DNA. You need to re interview this person. You need to put pressure. There really isn’t a blueprint. It really just a matter of what’s going to bring the strongest case. So I have the same question, like what in the world could they possibly need?
TJ (Donna’s brother): I’m okay with it. I mean as long as they gonna… do what they need to be done. You know what I’m saying?
Tucker Simmons: I mean my question for him was is anyone who worked the case originally going to be on the case? And he immediately said no.
Tucker Simmons: So that’s…
TJ (Donna’s brother): That’s what I was worried about.
Sherry (Donna’s Sister): Yeah, that’s a positive. That’s most definitely a positive. I really believe that Jason Smith has a very… I don’t even know how to say it, but I believe that he has a positive thing going. You know, like everything that has been happening, he’s making arrest that he’s like, I’m fixing clean up and I don’t care who likes it, who don’t. So I do feel like he’s, he is really doing everything that he has said he’s going to do so far.
Tucker Simmons: Yeah, I agree.
TJ (Donna’s brother): How you feel about it Tucker? You think that…
Tucker Simmons: I feel very positive. I mean it should have been at the Sheriff’s Office to begin with because it should have been handled properly. So I think it’s… like he said in his announcement video, it’s returning to the Sheriff’s Office where it should have stayed and it should have been looked at properly to begin with. So I’m feeling really good about it.
TJ (Donna’s brother): Good.
Sherry (Donna’s Sister): I am too. I am too Tucker. I really am. I feel like he has a personal, personal stake in us at this point. Like you said, he’come out publicly and now it’s personal, and…
Tucker Simmons: I think it’s, it’s the best we could ask for at this point. And he knows that we’re going to hold his feet to the fire no matter how much people like him.
tj: Yeah, I feel like does, he knows he’s got some pressure, you know.
Tucker Simmons: For sure, for sure. Well, I, I’ll keep you guys in the loop.
Sherry (Donna’s Sister): Okay, well, Happy… Merry Christmas and Happy New Year. If we don’t talk to you before then. TJ I love ya.
TJ (Donna’s brother): I love you, too Sherry.
Tucker Simmons: Y’all too. All right, well, thanks so much, guys, and I’ll be here if anything comes up.
TJ (Donna’s brother): Yes, sir. We appreciate you, brother.
Tucker Simmons: Take care.
Demmie Rice: Bye bye.
Tucker Simmons: Donna’s siblings, her mom, her kids, her loved ones, they really have blown me away with how they’ve handled this entire situation. Despite the anger, disappointment and grief, they haven’t lost hope. I think the public’s support has played a huge role in helping them get through such a tough time reliving Donna’s death so publicly. As the Sheriff stated, this won’t happen overnight, but continued progress is all we can ask for. Now, no episode of Freeze Frame would be complete without a call to Demmie. I had a feeling she’d already heard the news.
Demmie Rice: Good morning.
Tucker Simmons: Have you seen, Jason’s announcement?
Demmie Rice: I did. Best Christmas gift ever.
Tucker Simmons: I hear you. Yeah. I wanted to get your thoughts. I mean, how are you feeling about it?
Demmie Rice: Joyous. I am thrilled. I know that Jason Smith is going to see this case through and justice will be served in so many ways.
Tucker Simmons: A lot of people, I feel like they’re going to say the State Police have so many more resources and it should have stayed with them. And I mean, what’s your take on that?
Demmie Rice: Well, that is true. The State Police does have more resources. I feel they should have put more of an effort for. People are tired of this case dragging on for so long and there is enough evidence. There was enough evidence to begin with to make an arrest. I’ve told you before, Tucker, that God has many ways of doing things and it wasn’t meant for it to happen back then because so many more – Have since the podcast came out – so much more information has come out now. The Sheriff Jason Smith taking his case over. He will have the knowledge and the evidence to take this case to justice.
Tucker Simmons: From my understanding, the DA’s Office and a prosecutor has not been involved up to this point. So, like I told Sherry and TJ this morning, I think it’s probably the best thing that we could all ask for is for Jason to get it and have the DA’s Office cooperating.
Demmie Rice: Correct? We, we have a whole different DA now. I’ve met Collins Sim myself. if he’s presented with the proper evidence, he will prosecute. When I was taken off the case, and, when State Police I believe it was in March of ’19, I’m not certain, they came, I made personally copied everything all the interview disks, all the audio, all the photographs. However, after giving them that they had came back a second time, six months, a year later, saying they didn’t have something. And I had showed them my paper. I had them sign, yes, I did. Y’all misplaced it. Here’s proof. I gave it to you. We gave him whatever it was. But since that time that they, you know, picked up their copy, because I kept the originals, I kept it secured in a box inside of my Office. When I retired, and I went the Saturday after my last day and cleaned out my Office So I took the box, went down another hall where, there was an Office that were used for records for, another basic division, and slid that box into their records. I had secured it with an extra bunch of evidence tape and just scribbled Donna’s name on the top of the box and a bunch of my initials on the tape. And I had learned that, they were looking for the case file. Well, they were looking for a file, like a basic file, and I learned that they thought it was maybe locked in somebody’s desk or something. I’m like, no, it’s too big. So I let them know this is where you can find it. And that is where they went and found it, where I had left it. My reasons for doing that is because things disappeared over there. And, I mean, someday this. This case would come back to life.
Tucker Simmons: Well, that’s. That’s great news. I mean, I’m sure whatever the State Police handed over had a lot of that stuff in there, but hopefully there’s something that they found that will be useful.
Demmie Rice: I hope so, too. It’s a shame all decide to happen because, of negligence of others.
Tucker Simmons: I, for one, am grateful that there’s action being taken. And like I said, I think having the DA’s Office involved and helping figure out what is needed for the Grand Jury can only be seen as positive. So we’ll see what happens.
Demmie Rice: But how we Sherry and TJ?
Tucker Simmons: They were good. I think they were maybe a little bit caught off guard and surprised, but I, you know, they wanted to know what I thought, and I basically just said, I think it can be seen as nothing but positive at this point. The State Police have had it for a long time, and you and I have provided them information in the last couple months that wasn’t acted upon quickly.
Tucker Simmons: And I think a lot of that.
Tucker Simmons: May just be because they’re overwhelmed and have multiple cases at one time, and they feel good about it. They feel good about it.
Demmie Rice: Awesome! That is so awesome. You know, I just can’t reiterate enough how this. This is taking a, a weight off my chest after all these years.
Tucker Simmons: Thank you again for all of your help throughout the process. And we’re far from done.
Demmie Rice: No thank you is necessary. I’m just glad you reached out to me.
Tucker Simmons: Well, look, have a very Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year. I’m sure I’ll talk to you before then, but, I’ll keep you in the loop if I hear anything. And please do the same.
Demmie Rice: I will. I will.
Tucker Simmons: Have a good day and I will talk to you soon.
Demmie Rice: All right, love. Bye.
Tucker Simmons: Thanks, Demmie. Bye.
Tucker Simmons: It’s not uncommon for investigative agencies to be tight lipped about ongoing investigations. But as I’ve said many times, when there’s so much public interest in a case like Donna’s, I believe it’s important to let the public know what’s happening. If nothing else than to reassure the community that something is actually being done. In some ways, this is just the beginning. Once again, as usual, the team and I will do our best to keep you in the know. Until then, I’m, back at it on Episodes for Part Two. So far, we’ve unfolded the story in our investigation as it happened for us, but yesterday’s announcement was too significant not to address immediately. I appreciate your patience as we continue to investigate and we’ll make an announcement soon about the Release of Part Two. So until then, Merry Christmas, Happy Holidays, and Happy New Year. I’ll see y’all soon.
“Something Strange” by Tabitha Meeks: Look close, I see, something staring back at me … something strange in the air .
Tucker Simmons: Make sure you follow, rate and review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you’re listening. It’s a huge help in spreading the word about Donna’s case. Then head over to freeframepodcast.com for behind the scenes details on the investigation and follow us on socials at FreezeFramePod for exclusive content. Freeze Frame is a But Why Media production. It’s written and produced by me, Tucker Simmons, editing in post production by Evan Desagier, narration by Greg Gerringer and Carrie Lauren and our original music is Something Strange by Tabitha Meeks.